WASHBURN COUNTY – Wisconsin Attorney General Brad Schimel held a roundtable discussion in Washburn County on Tuesday, June 20, 2017. We were not able to attend but shortly after its conclusion the AG was kind enough to chat with DrydenWire.com on the phone to discuss the roundtable, the growing meth epidemic in our area, county staffing levels in regards to public safety, and a few other things.
The following is a synopsis of the 30-minute Q-and-A conversation.
DW: You were in Washburn County earlier speaking with city officials. Who did you invite?
AG: We invited local elected officials, county board chair, county board law enforcement committee chairman, the local town and village leadership, law enforcement, HHSD, DA's office, VW, and state legislators that represent the area.
DW: Are you going to all 72 counties or just Washburn County?
AG: All counties. This is number 26, we'll do 27 and 28 tomorrow. We'll keep plugging away and we'll knock this off. There is an awful lot that the counties have in common, in every one of them, in every single county we've been to - and we've been to all different parts of the state - are having concerns with a drug epidemic.
The issue is that for some it is heroin and opiates. For some it is methamphetamine. Some are getting hit by both. The further north and west you get the more it is mostly methamphetamine. The further south and east you get, the more it's just opiates. Then there is that middle area that it's flowing both ways. Most of the opiate problem is coming up from Chicago. Most of the meth problem is coming over from the Twin Cities. These guys are overlapping each other now.
DW: What is your goal behind having these roundtables?
AG: A whole bunch of things. One is, I'm still learning. I've lived virtually my whole life in Waukesha County and my whole adult working career has been in Waukesha County. So I need to not look at it with a Waukesha focus, I've gotta look at it with a focus on all the unique problems Statewide. So part of it's for me to learn more about unique challenges and the better I know this, the more effective we will be at advocating with the legislature at seeking out grant dollars to help us reach out and just identifying how the DOJ can best assist these counties. So that's a big piece of it... a big piece of it.
We invite the legislators to these in all the different regions because I want them to hear this. There's a lot of stuff that the local police departments and Sheriffs are saying that I already knew, they've already told me, but I want the state legislators to hear it so they go back to Madison and understand the nature of this drug problem and what they are hearing from law enforcement and human services.
Alike, we need to invest on the front end more. Way too often we're waiting until everything has fallen to pieces and the only options we have now are to throw this person in prison. If we had intervened earlier we could have avoided that in many cases. So that's what they are hearing and I want them to hear that more because I need them to be part of this. I need them to be willing to make that investment because you have to spend money right now that you're not going to realize the benefits of for a couple years down the road.
DW: What's the real life application in 4 to 6 months from now? By having these roundtables, how will you use this information?
AG: I'll give you an example - proof where it has worked.
We started these roundtables last summer. We were up in some of the north and western counties last summer and we had a chance to ask local experts direct questions about what do we need to do, where are we falling short on the methamphetamine epidemic, and they gave us concrete ideas that we used to submit federal grant applications. We got the largest methamphetamine grants, enforcement grants, in America that came to Wisconsin because we used the information we learned from Price County and Iron County and Vernon County and all these other places we've been up here in the north and west - and there are more but those are just some that come to mind momentarily here. That is where we got the information to be able to write effective grants.
We heard about problems that the information dies at the state lines. So effectively the drug dealers could just go across the St. Croix or the Mississippi River - depending on how far north they were - and they kind of leave us in their dust. Because of that, we entered into discussions with the State of Minnesota. We now have reciprocal agreements across state lines for the first time in recent history. Maybe they've done this sometime long in the past, but it's the first time I knew of it and we have cross-border memoranda of understanding between law enforcement where we are sharing information now on a regular on-going basis.
Growing out of that as well, growing out of those discussions, Wisconsin is now helping Minnesota open up their first High-Intensity Area Drug Trafficking Task Force. We've had one in Milwaukee for years but they didn't have one up in the Twin Cities area and we're helping them to get that established. And that's a Federal, State and Local law enforcement cooperative effort that's been very effective. So those are all things that grew out of the public safety roundtables we did last summer and last fall that are already spawning results.
DW: Specifically in regards to your roundtable in Washburn County, what were your key takeaways? What information did you receive that stood out?
AG: Actually, and it's interesting you ask that question, there were several things that in spite of this being County 26 for the roundtables, this is the first time I'd heard – and this is just a little away from the drug epidemic issue – that when it comes to emergency detentions for mental health commitments, which are closely related to the drug problem of course, but this is the first time I've heard it suggested that we need to have standardized medical clearance protocols.
DW: Yep, don't know what that means.
AG: Before law enforcement can take a person who needs to go to a mental health facility for a psychiatric evaluation of dangerousness, before they can take them there, law enforcement has to take them to a local hospital and get medical clearance. Right now, there is no definition as to what that medical clearance means. So you could have one of the staff at the facility okaying a simple physical exam, another one that's going to be requiring x-rays, where there's not any real clear reason for it. This is the first time that somebody suggested let's standardize these because you are standing in a hospital with a doctor looking right at you saying this person is fine, you can transport them, but you get nowhere because when you call Winnebago Mental Health Institution they are going to tell you no, you gotta do more. You should standardize this so that law enforcement and the medical professionals know what to expect. That's the first time I'd heard that and I think it's a good idea to take back and work on.
Now, in order for that to get accomplished, that would have to go through legislation. I believe we could probably do that through administrative rulemaking, because, the Department of Mental Health Services that runs Winnebago Mental Health Institution, they have the freedom within their legislative mandate to decide policy like that. Which will be much easier than legislation.
DW: Anything else that stood out from this specific roundtable?
AG: It was also the first county where someone handed me a written plan for an awareness program starting with grade school age kids and working it's way up. The Sheriff and HHSD Director here in Washburn County handed me a written plan that they've asked me to take a look at and they're pitching.
L-R: Wisconsin Attorney General Brad Schimel, Washburn County Sheriff Terry Dryden, Representative Romaine Quinn
When you do a prevention program you don't want to invest a ton of money in a colossal prevention program without having some certainty that it works. If it's not impacting people's behavior, you're wasting money. So what we will probably do is kick this off with some pilot programs in a handful of Counties and see if we can get some positive results there before we blast this statewide. So when the Sheriff and the Human Services Director have already prepared some ideas, well that gets them a leg up in the process of being perhaps one of the pilot counties we use. And everybody wants to be the pilot county because it means it's going to be some grant money that's going to come to help them establish systems.
DW: I recently read an article where you had stated that meth use now rivals opiates. In the article, you stated, “Meth addicts don't think rationally and tougher sentences won't deter them from using the drug, the best path is educating people about the drug.” So with that in mind, the Washburn County Sheriff's Office, for example, has had to discontinue their Counteract program due to being understaffed. With the surge of opiate and meth use in our area, law enforcement is having to spend more time on those investigations which are preventing them from being able to do their normal duties. Should this be considered a public safety concern?
AG: Absolutely. Certainly, resource shortages are a big part of the problem at all levels. The DA's program statewide is functioning at 1990 staffing levels, as well.
DW: Did you say 1990 staffing levels?
AG: Yes, the DA's offices statewide. They are over 120 prosecutors short statewide, that's absolutely a chokepoint. When you don't have enough people in the DA's office to process the cases, that means that a lot of cases are going to fall by the wayside; the armed robbery and the sexual assault case is going to get prosecuted, but not the retail theft case perhaps. And that retail theft case might have been our first opportunity to get a look at a young person who has taken their first steps down the road of criminality and taken a look at why, what are you up to, maybe have an earlier shot at addressing a budding drug problem.
Instead, we are waiting, we are forced because the system is overwhelmed to wait much later and it's going to take a lot more work to get them squared away.
It's the same issue for law enforcement as you have inadequate staffing, there's going to be more and more things that are going to have to be prioritized. And the danger is... have you heard of the broken windows approach?
DW: Yes.
AG: You know many in law enforcement advocate – and I'm a fan of that - because the broken windows approach does not say that you put more people in jail or prison, it actually says that you have to address the problems while they're little. When you do that, you can prevent the wholesale destruction of communities. You can prevent people from going further into criminality where they end up in prison. You gotta make an investment on the front end. So I'm a big advocate of making those front-end investments.
We know that those kinds of efforts, dollars spent on the front end go further than dollars spent on the back end.
DW: What advice would you give to counties like Washburn who may not have the funding/budget to be fully-staffed in order to be proactive regarding the public safety issues you're talking about?
AG: Well, it requires an investment up front... where you don't get the return for a while. Making the investment into diversive programs, into programs that are addressing people's problems earlier on rather than waiting to make that investment. It will pay off. Eventually, we are going to see fewer people getting to the higher levels of difficulties. So that's my advice to them is to make that investment.
The State needs to make that investment as well and we need to recognize that if the state invests money addressing problems earlier we will, long term, reduce the prison population which means we'll save a lot of money on that back end. We just have to be willing to make the investment right now. We are doing it at the state level, we just need to be doing it more.
DW: I've heard about either past or maybe current legislation discussing the current 0% levy for counties that would allow for an exemption for public safety. Have you heard of this?
AG: I have heard talk about building in exceptions to the levy caps for when it is public safety dollars, yes. I don't know that there is any particular progress to report on that.
DW: Would that be something you would support?
AG: I believe so. Because when you look at the core functions of government there are certain obligations like a healthy transportation infrastructure and all those things that are necessary if you want to have businesses be able to employ people here. But public safety... there is no function of government that is higher. I mean there are other things like protection of children and all that, and those are also significant, but nothing's a higher trump card than trying to make sure communities are safe. So I believe it's appropriate to let communities address their public safety issues as they best see fit and that may mean letting them go to their taxpayers to raise more money.
But they've gotta make the case for that.
DW: Referendum?
AG: Well, a referendum is one way to go but the other way is to make exceptions for public safety in the levy caps - this is a legislative determination.
I see these public safety issues as a challenge that is going to continue to cost the state countless dollars if we don't start addressing this more effectively now. It's going to grow so we have to do something different than what we're doing and so that does mean more resources. However, I think most taxpayers would say 'hey if this means that there's a dramatic lesser likelihood that my home is going to get burglarized or that there is going to be graffiti or other criminal problems in my community,' I think most people would say, if you're spending it wisely, I'm okay with that, but we have to have that commitment to spend it wisely
DW: Last question - and thank you again for taking the time to speak with us - what single message do you want to share with our readers?
AG: I really want them to know how dangerous it is to try methamphetamine, even once.
This is what I'm hearing from public safety and human services and treatment experts all over the northwestern part of the state. It is so often a one & done. You do it one time and you're addicted and you know people like to think oh I'm strong, it can't be me. It does happen every day that people try it and they are addicted and once you're down that path, it's so destructive and for so many, it's impossible to work your way out.
Don't. Ever. Start.
Meth is not a path to happiness, it's not a path to relief from whatever other problems you're experiencing... it is a path to hell.
Last Update: Jun 22, 2017 6:07 pm CDT
